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2019/06/12 - Treehouse Of Horror 
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Post Re: 2019/06/12 - Treehouse Of Horror
Dissension Wrote:
Squirrels bite off one another's tails to assert dominance. :3


The same behavior is also found among humans... ;)


Thu Jun 13, 2019 8:07 am
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Post Re: 2019/06/12 - Treehouse Of Horror
fenrirblack Wrote:
Domesticated pets like the Miltons or Zach are in a different category due to the fact they have been exposed to society. Jess is an outlier because her problem is not an intelligence one but one of ignorance. She does seem smart but due to the fact that she lived in the wild limited her knowledge. I don’t remember any “wild” mice. The only mice we’ve seen are pretty much domestic like Spo or Squeak or even the army back at the beginning.


Here's the question, though. Is Jess the outlier for the world at large or Truck and Falstaff? The raccoons are pretty terminally inept and not nearly as bright as they think. Jess is intelligent on her own, and has shown she can learn and adapt.

Minus the wolves and Gale, who as you point out are apex predators and not in the same class, who have we seen that are true ferals? Cory, who seems somewhere in the middle, and Ink, who is definite brighter than Falstaff or Truck.

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Thu Jun 13, 2019 11:57 am
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Post Re: 2019/06/12 - Treehouse Of Horror
dr_eirik Wrote:
fenrirblack Wrote:
Domesticated pets like the Miltons or Zach are in a different category due to the fact they have been exposed to society. Jess is an outlier because her problem is not an intelligence one but one of ignorance. She does seem smart but due to the fact that she lived in the wild limited her knowledge. I don’t remember any “wild” mice. The only mice we’ve seen are pretty much domestic like Spo or Squeak or even the army back at the beginning.


Here's the question, though. Is Jess the outlier for the world at large or Truck and Falstaff? The raccoons are pretty terminally inept and not nearly as bright as they think. Jess is intelligent on her own, and has shown she can learn and adapt.

Minus the wolves and Gale, who as you point out are apex predators and not in the same class, who have we seen that are true ferals? Cory, who seems somewhere in the middle, and Ink, who is definite brighter than Falstaff or Truck.

Bruno would be the closest to "true feral" since she didn't even seem to be able to talk or understand the most basic functions. Jess is the outlier while Truck and Falstaff seem to be the norm if not a little lower.

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Thu Jun 13, 2019 12:14 pm
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Post Re: 2019/06/12 - Treehouse Of Horror
fenrirblack Wrote:
Bruno would be the closest to "true feral" since she didn't even seem to be able to talk or understand the most basic functions. Jess is the outlier while Truck and Falstaff seem to be the norm if not a little lower.


I think that's selling Bruno a bit short. She's only in one strip, and Bino woke her up. She does a take to camera, then falls asleep on top of him. It looks like she understood Bino just fine, she just didn't care.

http://www.housepetscomic.com/comic/201 ... -all-bear/

EDIT: Whoops, I screwed up. She's not in one, she's in three, but in all of them she looks like she's going to head back to bed. I still don't think she doesn't understand, more that Bino is a distraction from her going back into hibernation.

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Thu Jun 13, 2019 12:30 pm
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Post Re: 2019/06/12 - Treehouse Of Horror
We need to see if we can get her in a scene where she isn't just woken up and shoved Bino under her armpits to see if she is completely feral or if she has some knowledge of how civilization works.


Thu Jun 13, 2019 7:15 pm
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Post Re: 2019/06/12 - Treehouse Of Horror
NHWestoN Wrote:
"I'll say hello. Jest ain't usual fer the cook to be intterduced to the main ingredients." Sarcophagus MacArbe.
"it isn’t etiquette to cut any one you’ve been introduced to." The Red Queen.
dr_eirik Wrote:
I wonder if we are about to go in a different direction than we all thought. It feels like he's burning a bridge with the raccoons. If he gets chased out of the treehouse, where does he go? Is there a path none of us have predicted?
This is Housepets!. Even with how much we try, there's always a path none of us predicted.
dr_eirik Wrote:
NHWestoN Wrote:
Jessica and Zachery seem pretty sharp, although you could argue that Zach is a domestic bunny. I'm not sure how smart Custom Ink is but she's pretty good at social cues, very kind and solicitous, and does read and write.


Yeah, Jessica in particular is a possible outlier, unless Falstaff and Truck are the outliers. We've also never interacted with a squirrel before in HP, they've only been mentioned once or twice and slammed into Peanuts window for no reason we ever knew. We've seen plenty of wild mice that seem to be on the ball so size is not a definitive factor. And the ferrets can't be that much bigger than Marion is now, and (for the most part) are pretty smart.

And I will learn how to spell squirrel without a spell-check before this arc is over!!
Squirrels.
fenrirblack Wrote:
The fact they they were exposed to humans and the fact they new enough about revolutionary armies demonstrates that they had to have been living within the confounds of the human dwellings for a long period of time. They are a weird case that exists in between wild and domestic.
I think we have different definitions of wild animals. Mice may have adapted to humans, but they haven't been domesticated by them, and they certainly haven't reaped the rewards like an education and a laid back lifestyle. Even in the comic at hand, there are two raccoons plotting to steal food from a human. Why are mice in a different category than raccoons wild when raccoons are a major constituency of said category.

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Fri Jun 14, 2019 12:19 am
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Post Re: 2019/06/12 - Treehouse Of Horror
I agree with Wallace. I don't see the mice as being domesticated. They are wild but they have learned to adapt but that doesn't mean they are domesticated as they have had no human interaction nor have they been the pets on actual human so it wouldn't be correct to say they aren't wild just because they managed to learn above civilization to take advantage of people not knowing that they aren't clueless so they can try to take over the world.


Fri Jun 14, 2019 1:06 am
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Post Re: 2019/06/12 - Treehouse Of Horror
Calling the mice wild still say a lot about their intelligence being linked to their social standing in the wild and size. They thought they could over throw Peanut's house which shows that they were not smart to begin with even if they were intelligent enough to form a ragtag army.

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Fri Jun 14, 2019 7:54 pm
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Post Re: 2019/06/12 - Treehouse Of Horror
Lets just say they were intelligent enough to band together but not so much that they didn't have a good plan to try to commandeer the Sandwich house.


Fri Jun 14, 2019 11:05 pm
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Post Re: 2019/06/12 - Treehouse Of Horror
Because of evolutionary tradeoffs, in the real world there are correlations between an animals intelligence and it's size, lifespan, litter size and other factors. This means larger animals are generally smarter. I feel, however, that that is not reflected in the comic. SPO, the definition of vermin seeing as Professor D'Angelo wanted his cat go get rid of him, worked toward a diploma and is versed in how politicians speak. Don't forget about the rat pack from the Guys and Dolls Imaginate that were just fine as actors. I disagree with your assessment that Cory is a train wreck. Of all the ferals, I'd rank Falstaff and Truck the lowest for intelligence.

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Sat Jun 15, 2019 4:23 am
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Post Re: 2019/06/12 - Treehouse Of Horror
Champion Wallace Wrote:
Because of evolutionary tradeoffs, in the real world there are correlations between an animals intelligence and it's size, lifespan, litter size and other factors. This means larger animals are generally smarter. I feel, however, that that is not reflected in the comic. SPO, the definition of vermin seeing as Professor D'Angelo wanted his cat go get rid of him, worked toward a diploma and is versed in how politicians speak. Don't forget about the rat pack from the Guys and Dolls Imaginate that were just fine as actors. I disagree with your assessment that Cory is a train wreck. Of all the ferals, I'd rank Falstaff and Truck the lowest for intelligence.


Feral intellects in Housepets seem to follow Rick's comic roles rather than reflecting the natural world. Mice in nature are fairly resourceful but poor eyesight limits their abilities (and survival). Spo and Squeak, on the other hand are pretty sharp, following the old comic motif of small folk, sharp minds. Skunks and possums are not nature's great intellects, either. Cory's clever and manipulative while Jessica's sharp and insightful, but their limited experiences with the human world make them vulnerable to misperceptions of their situation.

Truck and Falstaff are veteran characters, appearing in the comic's first year as typical (but inept) midnight marauders. Raccoons in the wild are actually pretty smart and adaptable. Over time, they've developed a kind of Abbott-and-Costello shtick which has guaranteed them recurring appearances as backup comedians. As I think we might be about see, the two have demonstrated some emotional depth. Truck especially has become less of "dumb" comic character over the years and more of a naive innocent.

Custom Ink, on the other hand, always struck me as as the most mature and accepting of the ferals. While her excessive devotion to "The Opener" gives her a special comic role in the strip, she has also shown a kindness (especially to Jessica) and openness to others that makes her something of a hub figure in the treehouse crew.

And Zachary is ... Well ... Zach.


Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:34 am
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Post Re: 2019/06/12 - Treehouse Of Horror
Champion Wallace Wrote:
Because of evolutionary tradeoffs, in the real world there are correlations between an animals intelligence and it's size, lifespan, litter size and other factors. This means larger animals are generally smarter. I feel, however, that that is not reflected in the comic. SPO, the definition of vermin seeing as Professor D'Angelo wanted his cat go get rid of him, worked toward a diploma and is versed in how politicians speak. Don't forget about the rat pack from the Guys and Dolls Imaginate that were just fine as actors. I disagree with your assessment that Cory is a train wreck. Of all the ferals, I'd rank Falstaff and Truck the lowest for intelligence.

Spo at this point is "domesticated" so doesn't count as "wild" or even "feral" anymore. By the time he was doing all that stuff like getting his diploma, he had been living with Fido for a while. Cory couldn't even handle going to the mall. True that Falstaff and Truck are the lowest but that's not really a surprise. I don't know a lot about Guys and Dolls but I wouldn't say what the mice did qualifies them as intelligent or says anything about their intelligence at all. Then there is this scene.

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Sat Jun 15, 2019 12:07 pm
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Post Re: 2019/06/12 - Treehouse Of Horror
I'll concede SPO, but I think Cory is one of the smarter characters. He has a successful con artist routine with Trinket. I too, have not seen the real Guys and Dolls, but I would think Big Nate was a character from that and was just as headstrong. Remember, in Hungry For Cheddar it was Grape who broke character, not the mice. This line of discussion originated because we were assessing if Truck was against interacting with Marion because squirrels are unintelligent among the ferals. Since we both agree that Falstaff and Truck are the lowest that gives incredulity to that thesis. We may be looking at this too logically. What if Falstaff and Truck don't like squirrels for, well, no good reason. In the real world, there is discrimination and it's not like you can trace every instance back to some rational or justification. Sometimes people are just mean and don't like people who are different.

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Sat Jun 15, 2019 5:20 pm
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Post Re: 2019/06/12 - Treehouse Of Horror
NHWestoN Wrote:
Feral intellects in Housepets seem to follow Rick's comic roles rather than reflecting the natural world. Mice in nature are fairly resourceful but poor eyesight limits their abilities (and survival). Spo and Squeak, on the other hand are pretty sharp, following the old comic motif of small folk, sharp minds. Skunks and possums are not nature's great intellects, either. Cory's clever and manipulative while Jessica's sharp and insightful, but their limited experiences with the human world make them vulnerable to misperceptions of their situation.

Truck and Falstaff are veteran characters, appearing in the comic's first year as typical (but inept) midnight marauders. Raccoons in the wild are actually pretty smart and adaptable. Over time, they've developed a kind of Abbott-and-Costello shtick which has guaranteed them recurring appearances as backup comedians. As I think we might be about see, the two have demonstrated some emotional depth. Truck especially has become less of "dumb" comic character over the years and more of a naive innocent.

Custom Ink, on the other hand, always struck me as as the most mature and accepting of the ferals. While her excessive devotion to "The Opener" gives her a special comic role in the strip, she has also shown a kindness (especially to Jessica) and openness to others that makes her something of a hub figure in the treehouse crew.

And Zachary is ... Well ... Zach.
Best analysis I've seen, Weston. Thanks for that :D

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Post Re: 2019/06/12 - Treehouse Of Horror
Champion Wallace Wrote:
I'll concede SPO, but I think Cory is one of the smarter characters. He has a successful con artist routine with Trinket. I too, have not seen the real Guys and Dolls, but I would think Big Nate was a character from that and was just as headstrong. Remember, in Hungry For Cheddar it was Grape who broke character, not the mice. This line of discussion originated because we were assessing if Truck was against interacting with Marion because squirrels are unintelligent among the ferals. Since we both agree that Falstaff and Truck are the lowest that gives incredulity to that thesis. We may be looking at this too logically. What if Falstaff and Truck don't like squirrels for, well, no good reason. In the real world, there is discrimination and it's not like you can trace every instance back to some rational or justification. Sometimes people are just mean and don't like people who are different.

Or they don't typically talk to food?

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Sun Jun 16, 2019 12:35 am
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Post Re: 2019/06/12 - Treehouse Of Horror
D-Rock Wrote:
Champion Wallace Wrote:
I'll concede SPO, but I think Cory is one of the smarter characters. He has a successful con artist routine with Trinket. I too, have not seen the real Guys and Dolls, but I would think Big Nate was a character from that and was just as headstrong. Remember, in Hungry For Cheddar it was Grape who broke character, not the mice. This line of discussion originated because we were assessing if Truck was against interacting with Marion because squirrels are unintelligent among the ferals. Since we both agree that Falstaff and Truck are the lowest that gives incredulity to that thesis. We may be looking at this too logically. What if Falstaff and Truck don't like squirrels for, well, no good reason. In the real world, there is discrimination and it's not like you can trace every instance back to some rational or justification. Sometimes people are just mean and don't like people who are different.

Or they don't typically talk to food?


Hmmmm. Despite the comic line, Falstaff does look a bit menacing. Maybe Marion's safe as long as the raccoons have no place to wash him up. Can you wash ice cream? I really don't know a lot about raccoons.


Sun Jun 16, 2019 2:50 pm
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Post Re: 2019/06/12 - Treehouse Of Horror
I have never heard of a raccoon going and eating a squirrel. I didn't even think it was possible. But now that I know, it might be something I will go take a look into then. :lol:


Sun Jun 16, 2019 11:05 pm
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Post Re: 2019/06/12 - Treehouse Of Horror
I 'd never seen a seagull eat a pigeon until a few days ago.


Mon Jun 17, 2019 11:59 am
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Post Re: 2019/06/12 - Treehouse Of Horror
I have seen pelicans eat crows but that is only on YouTube.


Mon Jun 17, 2019 12:21 pm
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