Housepets! Tails of Babylon! * Developer's Thread *

[KingFan202]

Shadow Peanut looks so 'Friendly' D:

But not the good kind.

[D-Rock]

Wanna play?

[CHAOKOCartoons]

It was a very one-sided conversation, I don't remember why I didn't partake in it. But anyway, I believe maybe not the game length needs to be changed, but I think what we each perceive as a chapter is different. We seem to be grouping the Peanut-Fido-Bino quest and the Grape-Max-Res quest Chapter 2, however I would group those as 2 different chapters considering they're massively different directions. You know,

Well of course it's gonna be one-sided if you don't object to anything! Ya gotta let us know while we're talking about it dude, the game's length is a pretty important topic to discuss as the lead developer.
Oh, yeah the only reason we called those two parts chapter 2 was because they took place at the same time. Both parts are actually as long as a chapter, so it would make sense to make them separate chapters. In the end of the day, it will still take the same amount of time to complete the game (the entire length of chapter 2 was accounted for). However, that may make the number of chapters un-even, and require even more chapters to balance it out. The problem with that is: how much would we even be able to write in in terms of locations? The comic has only showed us about enough to fill around 10 chapters. We've covered the forest, the temple (though that can be used at least twice I assume), the good ol' dogs club, deeper into the forest, the mall, the zoo, and the wolves home (planned for chapter 3). Other locations would be theme park world, the Milton Manner, the Farm (even though it was sold and is a long motorcycle ride away), Heaven (?), The City, PsyCon (?),the vet (now THAT's reaching a bit), and then Nue's celesial game board thingy and the Shadow Dimension. Do correct me if I am forgetting anything. I suppose we can also do an imaginate kinda deal for a chapter as well. Though thinking about it we can probably come up with something to fill in the chapters.

Alright, we shouldn't have to worry about weapons. I see things are perfectly fine for them.

The way it is right now from what I tested, I think the game's weapons should be designed to be found and not bought, while the armor will be purchasable with a few rare armor being hidden like the weapons. With that being said, i'll decide the stats for them. The script writers will have to do the fun job of deciding where to hide them :3

While you guys do that, another idea I like to throw in is if players can't find the weapons or discover them in the chapter they were in, they could be purchased in later chapters... for a hefty price. The armor and all other accessories will be purchasable.
With that being said, i'm sure we don't need anymore weapons. We just need to figure out where to hide them. The shops do all the rest.

I like that idea! Though you'll probably be able to re-visit areas before the game is over, this would be a good way to help the player keep up with power as well as make us hate Cory even more .

[GameCobra]

Hating Cory for selling you that weapon for a outrageous price for not finding it earlier is one of the beauties I like about this system. :3

And I'm sure we can script it as well, but try to script it so the weapon can't be backtracked after Cory receives it. Instead, Trinket will be where it was hidden at.

[Buster]

do these faces look the right shape?

Yeltsin's being a pain again.

[GameCobra]

It actually turned out fine. No worries. IF anything, the greyish dog's eyes maybe a little big.

[SuperStar]

@Chaoko... *takes medication* *breathes slowly* *jk* I understand perfectly what you're saying, and I already previously stated I was distracted by other subjects at the time. Anyway, there is always the possibility of Celestial Plains in the later parts of the games.

@Buster, looking good! But yeah, Yeltsin looks a little off... though I don't know how to fix it while keeping it Yeltsin...

[Saturn381]

Nice job, Buster. Is the dog in the top right corner Tarot or some other dog?

[D-Rock]

Maybe round out the back of the head a little?

Also, Rex's profile looks pretty good!

And Saturn, that dog in the top right is going to be Tiger when he's done. Peanut's sprite is simply a base.

And about Trinket and Cory finding the item and charging for it, I'm sure that this will be the players' reactions.

[Buster]

he needs a little work in the face area, but he's almost done at this point.

I already did tarot's sprites ages ago. you were there. I'm pretty sure you commented on them.

[GreatKitsune]

So, you're thinking of fighting each shadow multiple times or what? I thought they would be encountered once and that was it for each of them.

I can't see why not, but it's up to you guys and how the plot flows. I'm just messing with some ideas for the future :3

I'm also trying to see if it's possible to have a 4v4 with them somehow as a bonus boss battle. that would be awesome.

Not sure. First off,

I originally thought that these shadow clones should be fought one on one, then quickly realized that doing so and making the user uncontrollable would make it a luck-based fight, and who wants that? Also originally thought of fighting some of them in sets, such as dark Sabrina and Tarot, and dark Fido, Joey, and Bino. Again, though, having limited controllable characters would make that set-up problematic as well.

I don't like saying this, but I feel that doing that would diminish their importance to the characters. While it could be rather cool, it would also make them more like regular enemies instead of the inner darkness of their hearts that they have to face.

But what does everyone else think?

That would make the shadow fights less intimidating, an outcome which should be avoided if possible. (I beleive I've mentioned before my dislike of plots that fail to provide a serious antagonist. Antagonist design is pretty much my thing, so it bothers me greatly. ).

Well of course it's gonna be one-sided if you don't object to anything! Ya gotta let us know while we're talking about it dude, the game's length is a pretty important topic to discuss as the lead developer.
Oh, yeah the only reason we called those two parts chapter 2 was because they took place at the same time. Both parts are actually as long as a chapter, so it would make sense to make them separate chapters. In the end of the day, it will still take the same amount of time to complete the game (the entire length of chapter 2 was accounted for). However, that may make the number of chapters un-even, and require even more chapters to balance it out. The problem with that is: how much would we even be able to write in in terms of locations? The comic has only showed us about enough to fill around 10 chapters. We've covered the forest, the temple (though that can be used at least twice I assume), the good ol' dogs club, deeper into the forest, the mall, the zoo, and the wolves home (planned for chapter 3). Other locations would be theme park world, the Milton Manner, the Farm (even though it was sold and is a long motorcycle ride away), Heaven (?), The City, PsyCon (?),the vet (now THAT's reaching a bit), and then Nue's celesial game board thingy and the Shadow Dimension. Do correct me if I am forgetting anything. I suppose we can also do an imaginate kinda deal for a chapter as well. Though thinking about it we can probably come up with something to fill in the chapters.

I put a suggestion chapter-boss list up before with 10 regular chapters, a final chapter, 5 postgame chapters, and a post-final chapter. This amounted to 15 hour regular game, 6-7 hour postgame. To be honest, tho, it might work better to extend the regular game to 12-17 chapters and a final (and maybe a short pre-final). If it keeps the usual time legnth pattern, it would extend to about 17-22 hours or so, which seems ideal for the main plot. Then an eventual 10-12 hours of DLC bonus content and NO MO' POTO'!!!

[D-Rock]

NO MO' POTO'!!!

The heck does that mean?

Anyway, I'm always up for a long game if the story is enthralling.

[CHAOKOCartoons]

That would make the shadow fights less intimidating, an outcome which should be avoided if possible. (I beleive I've mentioned before my dislike of plots that fail to provide a serious antagonist. Antagonist design is pretty much my thing, so it bothers me greatly.

Well of course it's gonna be one-sided if you don't object to anything! Ya gotta let us know while we're talking about it dude, the game's length is a pretty important topic to discuss as the lead developer.
Oh, yeah the only reason we called those two parts chapter 2 was because they took place at the same time. Both parts are actually as long as a chapter, so it would make sense to make them separate chapters. In the end of the day, it will still take the same amount of time to complete the game (the entire length of chapter 2 was accounted for). However, that may make the number of chapters un-even, and require even more chapters to balance it out. The problem with that is: how much would we even be able to write in in terms of locations? The comic has only showed us about enough to fill around 10 chapters. We've covered the forest, the temple (though that can be used at least twice I assume), the good ol' dogs club, deeper into the forest, the mall, the zoo, and the wolves home (planned for chapter 3). Other locations would be theme park world, the Milton Manner, the Farm (even though it was sold and is a long motorcycle ride away), Heaven (?), The City, PsyCon (?),the vet (now THAT's reaching a bit), and then Nue's celesial game board thingy and the Shadow Dimension. Do correct me if I am forgetting anything. I suppose we can also do an imaginate kinda deal for a chapter as well. Though thinking about it we can probably come up with something to fill in the chapters.

I put a suggestion chapter-boss list up before with 10 regular chapters, a final chapter, 5 postgame chapters, and a post-final chapter. This amounted to 15 hour regular game, 6-7 hour postgame. To be honest, tho, it might work better to extend the regular game to 12-17 chapters and a final (and maybe a short pre-final). If it keeps the usual time legnth pattern, it would extend to about 17-22 hours or so, which seems ideal for the main plot. Then an eventual 10-12 hours of DLC bonus content and NO MO' POTO'!!!

I sort of agree with the point you raise about the shadows. Re-fighting them would diminish their importance quite a bit. However it would not make them like normal enemies. If the boss is far more powerful than it originally was, it makes it more respectable as a boss. HOWEVER, it looses it's purpose as anything else but just a challenge to overcome, and THAT is the problem with making them re-fightable. They would loose their value as villains, as you mentioned, but not as bosses.
Though we did say we would deal with the shadows later. We are in no shape to discuss in-depth about how the bosses will work at the moment.
Firstly, why have it be 10 chapters THEN the final chapter? That's just 11 chapters, which was the whole reason I even said we'd need more chapters to balance out the odd counting. And the after game shouldn't have chapters. It's the player given the objective to defeat the shadows, where they get to free roam and search for the shadows (also giving them time to level and money grind freely). The only time something would be linear would probably be when it comes time to fight Shadow Nue and Olde, and then Barghest. There can't be chapters because the end can't be paced, 1-3 hours is just assuming the player knows where to go and can beat each shadow in one go. Though instead of counting how long the game SHOULD be, why don't we just write the story and then decide how long it is when were sure we've covered enough ground to give the game a definitive ending? We seem to be structuring it as if it where a fan fic-- I mean it technically is, but that's not a sound way of writing a game.
Also, don't even start with that DLC bunk. I don't even want to hear that word in regards to this game, it's actually starting to annoy me (which is quite hard to do).

[Buster]

aparently i saved this instead of posting it. whoops! better late than never.

(though I'm still confused about the whole shadow joey thing since he's not a main party member).

Joey and Karishad were added to the main character sprite sheets to fill empty spaces, which led to joey being included in the shadow spritesheets by accident, after which i got the idea to give him a Seven-Force themed mechsuit, and wasted time on spriting a transformation sequence that later got cut.

[SuperStar]

We never said that minor characters wouldn't have final weapons, considering you get to play as them in the afterstory. So by that logic Joey would have a Shadow to fight, and so would the other minors. Note, One timers will be playable in the afterstory, but I don't think they should have a final weapon/shadow counterpart.

[Buster]

i was just clarifying how it got started.

[CHAOKOCartoons]

Okay, so just the minor characters, got it! You'll have to remind me which are minors and which are one timers when I get done with the main shadows .

Also, I made the layout for how the first section of the mall should look like. The tiles will be different when Super makes it, but this was just to establish what was where:

Basically, Max and Grape will enter through that little carpeted area to the south. As seen in the comic, there is some sort of fountain in the middle. There are 4 benches surrounding the fountain (as examined in real life malls). The 4 sign wall thingies diagonal from the fountain are adds and mall directories/maps (also as examined by real life malls). Tables/food courts on either side, implying that there are food stores under the upper level bridge (as seen in the comic). An double escalator in the middle, surrounded by foliage (according to the comic, there is some form of foliage near the food courts). A few stores on the bottom near the escalator, along with some stores on the top level. The left and right of the upper level also have stores as indicated by the red carpets. And finally, the path to the next portion of the mall right after the escalator.
Thoughts?

[SuperStar]

Okay, looks do-able. Though, uh, could you give me the scale numbers? like whatBywhat? It would make it a whole lot easier.

[D-Rock]

Looks like a good start. And Chaoko, here's where the cast list is at the moment.

-Major Party Members-
Peanut
Grape
Tarot
Max
King
Fox
Sabrina
Bailey
Fido
Bino

-Minor Party Members-
Sasha
Rex
Joey
Zach
Kevin
Ralph
Tiger
Marvin
North Star
At least one or two ferrets(Personally I'm thinking Keene and Rock)
Possibly Res

-One-Time Party Members-
Itsuki
Jessica
(?)Celestial Nerds(?)

-NPCs-
Most of the Wolves
All the Humans
Fiddler & Keys
The Bigglesworths
The other ferrets
Cory
Falstaff & Truck
Daisey
Ducchess
Boris
Yeltsin
Devo
Sten
Griswold
And any other characters I'm forgetting
---

[SuperStar]

That reminds me. The two ferrets. I was talking with Civilization; my ferret enthusiast friend, a bit ago, and he helped me think of something. What if Keene's starting weapon is a fireplace poker? Like what he used to fend of the gargoyles.

[GameCobra]

A Poker or a cane would be my preferred weapon for Keene if not King. A scrooge or rich character needs one :3

[D-Rock]

I think I'm up for Keene using a poker as a starter, but what would his weapon type ultimately be? Also, maybe a way to work in the knife he used in the Temple Crashers arc?

And Cobra, I think it's funny for him to use a cane. Soul Calibur 2 had a fencer who's joke weapon was a cane, and with every strike, an unseen crowd would cheer. Absolutely hilarious when performing a 10-hit grapple with it!

[GameCobra]

I got an idea since you brought up the poker ultimate: "The Milton Pride", or in a less symbolic nature, "Law of Nature" - since Keene makes the laws =P

We can give him both a poker and a cane now that I think about it.

[D-Rock]

Now what would it actually be, though? I could go for a stylized cane. What type of weapon would that be considered, though? Dueling swords like an epee, sabre, and the like? Or just canes?

[SuperStar]

Now what would it actually be, though? I could go for a stylized cane. What type of weapon would that be considered, though? Dueling swords like an epee, sabre, and the like? Or just canes?

Minor characters get about 5 weapons. So...
It could start with a cane, then he gets a poker, then a fancy vaguely cane styled rapier, then the monster rapier and then of course his legendary weapon. Sound good?

[D-Rock]

Sounds good to me.

[KingFan202]

Does anyone need anything from me?

Input about armor? Suggestions?

etc

I havent been chatting much, So im just checking in.

[D-Rock]

Anything, really. Feel like we hit another slow period. If you have more ideas for armor, go ahead and tell us.

[GameCobra]

I wouldn't worry about any armor designs yet. I might already have plenty of ways to make game armor as it is. We could make some legendary armor, but we can wait until end-game for that. I'm also trying to incorporate some interesting ideas, but haven't finalized them yet.

For example, Peanut may have a fire fighter's hat that gives him water magic while Grape gets Pete's feather, which gives her fire/lightning/ice claw moves. I might ask for custom sprites for Pete's feather at least, but like I said, give it time for now. :3

[GreatKitsune]

NO MO' POTO'!!!

The heck does that mean?

I'm all out of potatoes!

Anyways, just got back from Oklahoma.

Also, CHAOKO, I wasn't serious about DLC. It was just a joke. And I'vee seen chapter based games often refer to the final chapter as Chapter Final or F, while the others are all numbered. If this was followed here, there would be chapters 1-9 and F, which would lead to the whole awkward counting thing. You're probably right about chapter patterns not working in postgame, tho'.

[D-Rock]

Huh, never heard a phrase like that, before, Kitsune.

Also, this is very likely just me, but is it that big of a deal if the chapter count is odd or even?

[SuperStar]

Huh, never heard a phrase like that, before, Kitsune.

Also, this is very likely just me, but is it that big of a deal if the chapter count is odd or even?

Well, after many hard thoughts I have concluded that the best way to explain it, is in a song! *everyone groans*
https://youtu.be/tnzz-eFmKaw?t=1m26s

But yeah, there's no real reason for it.

[D-Rock]

Wow, surprisingly good song. Silly lyrics, yet really well sung, so I'll give it an eight out of-
WRONG THREAD!

By the way, sorry for not posting anything lately. Could be getting home tired from work (which I do), or almost always having something else come up (which it does), but really, I'm out of graph paper, and I can't make a straight line to save my life on normal paper.

Heck, when I first made designs a few years ago, I straight up made my own reference lines, just too lazy to do that now. But I have tomorrow and Monday off, let's see if I get something done. Only have three more for Fido.

[Buster]

Right. So, more asymmetry in the sprites, random background colors for the sheets, and only prime numbered chapters get title cards, got it.


JK.

[SuperStar]

BTW, if Chaoko is reading this, I still need the height and width of the mall center.

[Buster]

Done.

Also, had an idea for a chapter. Nue and Olde's shenanigans are making certain spirits restless, such as a certain teleporting specter from the K-9 unit's first arc. The enemies for that chapter would be ghosts 'n such, forcing the player to change tactics, as the techniques effective against incorporeal beings are different than corporeal ones. And Teoxihuitl could make a return appearance as the boss. Apparently he made a deal with a certain duo, looks like Sabrina helping with his 'coming to terms' with his existence wasn't as effective as previously thought (Or N/O are messing with him, one or the other).

[KingFan202]

I wouldn't worry about any armor designs yet. I might already have plenty of ways to make game armor as it is. We could make some legendary armor, but we can wait until end-game for that. I'm also trying to incorporate some interesting ideas, but haven't finalized them yet.

For example, Peanut may have a fire fighter's hat that gives him water magic while Grape gets Pete's feather, which gives her fire/lightning/ice claw moves. I might ask for custom sprites for Pete's feather at least, but like I said, give it time for now. :3

Well cobra i am in charge of armor. not you. Im being blunt since you dont seem to understand that otherwise.

[GameCobra]

Well cobra i am in charge of armor. not you. Im being blunt since you dont seem to understand that otherwise.

no, I fully understand that. I'm talking about the RPG maker in general and it's armor system, though. I'm just suggesting that we don't have to worry about armor right now, but I apologize again if i'm sounding like i'm controlling something I shouldn't be.

I'm just trying to think ahead here while we're at this part since I want to make a list of what types of weapons and armor we have and start balancing them now while we're here. It looks like while i'm doing the math here that there will be a grand total of 150 weapons (10 per main character, 5 per side character as quoted) ... how much armor are we making?

EDIT: I have to apologize for something, though: when I mentioned the firefighter hat and blue feather, that was my fault. That was me trying to find a way to give Peanut and Grape some excuse to use magic while designing their skills. They are just placeholders I added.

[KingFan202]

Well cobra i am in charge of armor. not you. Im being blunt since you dont seem to understand that otherwise.

no, I fully understand that. I'm talking about the RPG maker in general and it's armor system, though. I'm just suggesting that we don't have to worry about armor right now, but I apologize again if i'm sounding like i'm controlling something I shouldn't be.

I'm just trying to think ahead here while we're at this part since I want to make a list of what types of weapons and armor we have and start balancing them now while we're here. It looks like while i'm doing the math here that there will be a grand total of 150 weapons (10 per main character, 5 per side character as quoted) ... how much armor are we making?

EDIT: I have to apologize for something, though: when I mentioned the firefighter hat and blue feather, that was my fault. That was me trying to find a way to give Peanut and Grape some excuse to use magic while designing their skills. They are just placeholders I added.

Alright lol.

Sorry if i sounded angry

Feel free to let me know how many individual pieces of armor we need and I'll try to think of some more.

[CHAOKOCartoons]

BTW, if Chaoko is reading this, I still need the height and width of the mall center.

52x55

Also on the whole chapter thing, we dont NEED an even number I just feel that if we're gonna use the number system we might as well keep it orderly. I still feel that it's odd that were using chapters in the first place, but it keeps things measured out at least. I'd rather just do the "write till it's done" route, but if we don't have set amount the story can be it's pretty much the same thing .